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Old 01-26-2009, 12:17 PM
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Default Replacment Antenna for Dir-825 Dual Band

Hello,
I have a DIR-825 dual band N router, and I want to buy a new antennas, something simple that will be a bit stronger then originals.
Now I know that its very simple to replace, my question is if I need a special Antenna that supports 5Ghz band or I can use regular antenna that sold for routers?

the original Antenna is marked with "2.4/5ghz" text on it

Thank you
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Old 01-26-2009, 12:45 PM
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Do you need one for both 2.4 and 5 GHz operation, or just one band? If the latter, matching the band will do.

High-gain dual-band omnidirectional antennas are expensive (based on what I've seen), but you can find a panel antenna for cheap. The downside of directional antennas is that the increased gain comes at an expense of coverage area. If you are trying to reach a single client, using a panel antenna may work, but it would be ill suited for blanketing an entire house.
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Old 01-26-2009, 12:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdabbs View Post
Do you need one for both 2.4 and 5 GHz operation, or just one band? If the latter, matching the band will do.

High-gain dual-band omnidirectional antennas are expensive (based on what I've seen), but you can find a panel antenna for cheap. The downside of directional antennas is that the increased gain comes at an expense of coverage area. If you are trying to reach a single client, using a panel antenna may work, but it would be ill suited for blanketing an entire house.
I use 5Ghz band only and everything is in one room, basically 2 meters from each other.
Its just i want to hide the router between the cabinet and the wall, make it invisible..
And i seen 10-15$ Chinese antennas with better specs the original small ones..

Thanks for the link, its affordable but i need to buy 2, i can hide the router and put the antenna on top of the cabinet facing my pc/xbox/ps3

Btw if i replace only one of the 2 will it be any netter or should i buy 2?


Ok, I found 2 any recommendations whats better?

http://cgi.ebay.com/TERK-WF-D-DUAL-B...2em118Q2el1247

http://cgi.ebay.com/GEMINI-WADD60F-W...QQcmdZViewItem

Last edited by Viruzz_IL; 01-26-2009 at 01:06 PM.
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Old 01-26-2009, 04:03 PM
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Even with 2 dBi antennas, the signal should be able to penetrate a wood/glass cabinet. Have you tested it yet?

If the signal is adequate, you may actually see a performance drop by using panel antennas, depending on how diversity is affected (and the extent upon which current 11n routers depend on it, which is not something I've experimented with). One antenna should be enough for connectivity, but two will be better for performance.

To gauge the benefit of the antennas, I'd look at the antenna gain, the signal loss (attenuation) of the wire, which is also a function of its length, and whether an adapter is required. Both antennas have the same gain, the signal loss is not explicitly mentioned, and both have an adapter (though what connection that is being adapted determines whether you need to at all). I'd contact the sellers and ask for the cable length\type, and the connector at the end of the cable.
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Old 01-26-2009, 04:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdabbs View Post
Even with 2 dBi antennas, the signal should be able to penetrate a wood/glass cabinet. Have you tested it yet?

If the signal is adequate, you may actually see a performance drop by using panel antennas, depending on how diversity is affected (and the extent upon which current 11n routers depend on it, which is not something I've experimented with). One antenna should be enough for connectivity, but two will be better for performance.

To gauge the benefit of the antennas, I'd look at the antenna gain, the signal loss (attenuation) of the wire, which is also a function of its length, and whether an adapter is required. Both antennas have the same gain, the signal loss is not explicitly mentioned, and both have an adapter (though what connection that is being adapted determines whether you need to at all). I'd contact the sellers and ask for the cable length\type, and the connector at the end of the cable.
Thank you for all your time, you really helped me.
Last question if i may, i found this product, what do you think, maybe its better to buy 2 of these or one of these and one of the other type?
Im the only one who use this, so its for one room one person..

http://cgi.ebay.com/TERK-WF-R-DUAL-B...hippingPayment


Right now when the router is on the ground on one side of desk and the Bridge is on top of the desk i get 80-85% signal and rate is jumping from 270 at top to 80 at lowest, usually its in the 200 region..

I see this by looking in web setting of router..
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Old 01-26-2009, 04:34 PM
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Unless these have sort of power signal gain booster on them not really going to see a lot of difference then again EMI/EMF would be another factor in this. Most 2dBi-3dBi or 4dBi are just fine. You could but extenders and make them 5dBi, 6dBi, 7dBi, 8dBi or 9dBi but then again would you see a huge difference? Just slightly. That's why Wireless Access Points are use to fill in the dead spots in wireless network. You could bridge a WDS (also known as Wireless Bridge Client) with a secondary WAP from primary WAP which would be the main WAP. It does work and the signal strength is not bad in area where no Ethernet LAN cable or Jack Port is present or can't be used in.

Last edited by tipstir; 01-26-2009 at 04:40 PM.
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Old 01-26-2009, 05:55 PM
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Before throwing money at the problem, I would first try to ascribe a cause to signal quality, as that'll determine the solution.

I don't have anything to use as a baseline, so I'm not sure if 80-85% is a problem or representative of normal operation. However, there are ways to test:

1) Too many clients operating. Start turning clients off. Does signal quality improve?

2) Range\placement. Is your router positioned to make the most of reflection? Try setting the router in various places to see if quality improves. If there's an improvement by moving the router a bit further from a wall, it's a placement issue. Also try moving the router closer to the clients. In the other thread, Tim mentioned the possibility of the interference caused by both the client and AP being in close proximity. If signal gets worse, then that may be the cause, in which case upgrading to better antennas would only hurt your situation. Likewise, if moving the router further away improves quality, then proximity is the likely problem.

As far as mixing antennas are concerned, diversity may be affected. I don't know what the performance penalty will be. By going all omnis (and attaching them directly to the device), you eliminate this situation. The antenna you linked to did not have a dBi rating; for all we know, it may be rated the same as the ones you have now.
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Old 01-26-2009, 06:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdabbs View Post
Before throwing money at the problem, I would first try to ascribe a cause to signal quality, as that'll determine the solution.

I don't have anything to use as a baseline, so I'm not sure if 80-85% is a problem or representative of normal operation. However, there are ways to test:

1) Too many clients operating. Start turning clients off. Does signal quality improve?

2) Range\placement. Is your router positioned to make the most of reflection? Try setting the router in various places to see if quality improves. If there's an improvement by moving the router a bit further from a wall, it's a placement issue. Also try moving the router closer to the clients. In the other thread, Tim mentioned the possibility of the interference caused by both the client and AP being in close proximity. If signal gets worse, then that may be the cause, in which case upgrading to better antennas would only hurt your situation. Likewise, if moving the router further away improves quality, then proximity is the likely problem.

As far as mixing antennas are concerned, diversity may be affected. I don't know what the performance penalty will be. By going all omnis (and attaching them directly to the device), you eliminate this situation. The antenna you linked to did not have a dBi rating; for all we know, it may be rated the same as the ones you have now.
I have dir-825, i checked on dlink's web site and there is no info is about dB..

About the too many clients issues i dont think its even a possibility, all my wireless equipment working exclusively on Wireless N 5Ghz band, 2.4Ghz band is disabled...

When i tested 2.4ghz G, i was able to find at most 5 other users, but in 5Ghz N, im the only one..

I did some research and the TERK WF-D Directional WiFi Antenna comes with 1m cable, Up to 8dB

TERK WF-R Omni is Up to 7dB

Ill test the proximity issue, but i dont think it will help, because when i was setting everything up, the router and bridge were standing 10cm from each other and i got 100% signal

thanks again
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Old 01-26-2009, 07:22 PM
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The DIR-825 has 2 dBi antennas, so the one you linked is better, assuming the specs are correct.

By too many clients, I was referring to client density. 3 devices operating at full strength in the same room is different from 3 scattered across a building.

If you were able to get 100% before, then it's likely you'll be able to reach it again. If you can't, then you need to start identifying causes.
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Old 01-26-2009, 07:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdabbs View Post
The DIR-825 has 2 dBi antennas, so the one you linked is better, assuming the specs are correct.

By too many clients, I was referring to client density. 3 devices operating at full strength in the same room is different from 3 scattered across a building.

If you were able to get 100% before, then it's likely you'll be able to reach it again. If you can't, then you need to start identifying causes.
aha, i understand now, actually it was going to be DWA-160 Dual Band N adapter for my PC and DIR-1522 Dual Band N Bridge for Xbox 360 and PS3.
But since everything is on the same table i removed DWA-160 USB adapter and connected my PC to the bridge and i have a feeling that it works better then before, i got random disconnects with USB adapter but now it works rock solid, 5m ago i changed wireless settings to force 240mb speed to see what happens, from what i understand it should disconnect in case it cant achieve this speed? And if it wont i can leave it this way?

So i think im going to order these 2 antennas to see what happens, they not that expensive so in case it wont work ill ebay them or give a friend, this way i can hide the router inside a closet and only make a hole for the antenna cable and put the antenna on top of the closet in highest place available, i just played a bit with a router and the higher it was the better signal was, i even got 100% on top of the shelf...


Thank you very much, you helped me to a lot and i finally found what i need.

last question, what do you think, what will be faster/better if i use my xbox 360 with the bridge and pc with adapter or both pc and xbox with bridge?

I mean for individual speed of each device?
Can it hurt the speed because they use the same bridge to connect or its a same thing because the router will have to communicate with both of them anyway?
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